N-Scale SP Brass from MORE Co. LIK Enterprises

[spookshow]

Thanks, Bob. I decided to go with one of the black GS-6's. Can't go wrong with SP, right? 

Cheers,
-Mark

[jnevis]

ummmm....just my not as detail oriented as most here, but the WP GS-64 is the same as an SP GS-6, as they came from the same order.  The only reason the WP had them at all is they needed extra power for troop/supply trains in WW2 and the War Dept told Alco to split up an SP order to them and a couple other roads, don't remember which.

[Cajonpassfan]

While that might be true, plastic models are getting pretty darn close (detail wise) to older brass models.  Especially on streamlined steam locos.  They also run so much better than brass, and they cost a fraction of what brass costs.  Brass models are also not always perfect. Some shapes are better rendered in injection-molded plastic.

I'm not knocking bras here - I own several brass models and I like them very much. 
But (while I hate to use this phrase), the paradigm has shifted.

No argument there, Peteski, that's why I used the term "brass workmanship"... But there no denying these are some of the finest N Scale brass ever made.
Otto K.

[SP-Wolf]

ummmm....just my not as detail oriented as most here, but the WP GS-64 is the same as an SP GS-6, as they came from the same order.  The only reason the WP had them at all is they needed extra power for troop/supply trains in WW2 and the War Dept told Alco to split up an SP order to them and a couple other roads, don't remember which.

This is partially correct. The war board did divert 6 GS-6's to another road. And- only one... the WP. And-- these are the one and "ONLY" GS class that was termed "War Babies". As they were ordered during the war. (More controversy) -- but- hopefully in fun.

Any way- my 2 pennies,
Wolf

[havingfuntoo]

To add my little bit as well to the story,the original GS order put up by SP was knocked back by the War Board, they had ordered more GS4s. The War Board said they did not need any more passenger engines, so the SP changed the spec to the GS2 specs resubmitted and called them General Service Locos. WP had an order for six 4-8-4s based are some out shopped C&O units which were approved by the War Board but then got cancelled. The War Board allocated six out of the SP order to take their place. There are some minor differences between the two locos other than the elephant ears. The Central of Georgia also got eight 4-8-4s with the same boilers and running gear as the GS2s, they did not have skyline casings and had normal smoke box doors and a few other things that were different. The WP locos at the end of their time with WP were sold to SP for parts less their tenders, so they finished up in the SP system in the end.     

[JMaurer1]

And here's my $.02:

The GS-6's and GS-64-77's (what the WP called them) were ordered in 1943. While they retained the skyline casing on the top of the boiler (the SP considered it a 'smoke lifter'), they did not have the side skirting of previous GS locomotives since the war board decided that the skirting was for 'decoration only'. Driver size was also reduced from 80" to 73" since these were to be 'general service' locomotives and not just for passenger use (like the GS-4's and 5's). Certain devices that the SP held patents on (like the oil burner) were also removed and the WP requested Franklin boosters be installed, making them slightly different from the SP engines upon delivery. It wasn't until after WW2 (1947) that the WP added the 'elephant ear' smoke lifters. By Jan 1953, the WP had removed all of the GS-64-77's from service selling three to the SP (less tenders) for parts. The three tenders were kept by the WP and converted them to steam generators for rotary snowplows.

One GS-6 survives today, Southern Pacific 4460, which pulled the final movement of steam on the Southern Pacific Railroad in 1958. It was donated to the Museum of Transportation in St. Louis, Missouri. No WP GS-64-77's survived.

[Roger Holmes]

I'm not knocking bras here -

I don't knock them either if they are lacy.  Otherwise I prefer none.

Sorry, Peteski.  Your typo gave me a huge grin and I had to offer a little commentary.

Now back to a very interesting thread even for a Milwaukee Road modeler.  Those SP engines (and the NYC) are gorgeous!

[spookshow]

Bob, I'm curious if you've ever run into any stalling problems with yours? One thing I noticed right away with mine is that the spring in the pilot truck seems to be a tad bit too robust - actually lifting the front end of the engine up higher than the back end.

In testing, I had quite a few stalls. So, I decided to remove the pilot truck entirely and see what sort of difference that might make. And sure enough, it now runs flawlessly. So, I'm thinking that that spring is probably lifting the drivers up off the rails ever so slightly (thus impacting pickup). In light of that, I'm considering swapping the spring out for something a little less springy. My guess is that it impacts pulling power as well, although I haven't gotten to those tests yet.

Thanks,
-Mark

[JMaurer1]

I don't knock them either if they are lacy.  Otherwise I prefer none.

...especially if the head light is on   

[spookshow]

Bob, I'm curious if you've ever run into any stalling problems with yours? One thing I noticed right away with mine is that the spring in the pilot truck seems to be a tad bit too robust - actually lifting the front end of the engine up higher than the back end.

In testing, I had quite a few stalls. So, I decided to remove the pilot truck entirely and see what sort of difference that might make. And sure enough, it now runs flawlessly. So, I'm thinking that that spring is probably lifting the drivers up off the rails ever so slightly (thus impacting pickup). In light of that, I'm considering swapping the spring out for something a little less springy. My guess is that it impacts pulling power as well, although I haven't gotten to those tests yet.

OK, nevermind all that. I put the pilot truck back on (using the original spring) and it still ran flawlessly (IE no stalls). I guess it must've just been an assembly issue that I accidentally fixed by taking things apart and putting them back together.

Cheers,
-Mark

[Norway2112]

OK, nevermind all that. I put the pilot truck back on (using the original spring) and it still ran flawlessly (IE no stalls). I guess it must've just been an assembly issue that I accidentally fixed by taking things apart and putting them back together.

Cheers,
-Mark

Mark, I have four of these engines and have never experienced any of the stalling you describe or issues with the pilot truck.  I suspect you're correct in it was an assembly issue.

[robert3985]

Bob, I'm curious if you've ever run into any stalling problems with yours? One thing I noticed right away with mine is that the spring in the pilot truck seems to be a tad bit too robust - actually lifting the front end of the engine up higher than the back end.

In testing, I had quite a few stalls. So, I decided to remove the pilot truck entirely and see what sort of difference that might make. And sure enough, it now runs flawlessly. So, I'm thinking that that spring is probably lifting the drivers up off the rails ever so slightly (thus impacting pickup). In light of that, I'm considering swapping the spring out for something a little less springy. My guess is that it impacts pulling power as well, although I haven't gotten to those tests yet.

Thanks,
-Mark

Mark,

Both of my son's engines were a little stiff at first, but after half an hour running around the layout, they're fine now.  The only problem I've seen with them is that one of them has drivers that are spaced significantly farther apart than NMRA specs, which makes it bump a little through my tight NMRA spec hand-built turnouts.  The other one is perfect out of the box.

I've also checked all the soldered-on parts and they are all secure as opposed to previous findings and advice.

I'll comment on the unskirted GS-2 when my son gets it out of layaway.

[Mike Madonna]

Mark, I have four of these engines and have never experienced any of the stalling you describe or issues with the pilot truck.  I suspect you're correct in it was an assembly issue.

Hmmm... "four" of them? You must have been "on the hunt" or went back for more. 

[peteski]

I don't knock them either if they are lacy.  Otherwise I prefer none.

Sorry, Peteski.  Your typo gave me a huge grin and I had to offer a little commentary.

I wholeheartedly agree. How about huge pink ones?  (yes, that is me having fun)


Back to the topic....

[Norway2112]

Hmmm... "four" of them? You must have been "on the hunt" or went back for more. 

I went back for more, and now I don't regret it b/c the prices they're bringing now definitely made it worth while to buy when I did!  Possibly my favorite engines on my roster, still hunting for that MT-5 though....