Author Topic: Atlas N Coil Cars  (Read 2824 times)

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Teditor

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Re: Atlas N Coil Cars
« Reply #15 on: June 26, 2014, 02:35:26 AM »
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They were $29.95 when announced in 2011.

Is that dollar the breaker?  :trollface:

Jason

Wish the prices would come down to that level in the Land Down Under.

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havingfuntoo

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Re: Atlas N Coil Cars
« Reply #16 on: June 26, 2014, 02:58:19 AM »
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These cars are selling for $19.99 at several of the favourites (not ebay have not looked there). They are nice cars and look good IMHO, and at that price you can get them to down under for about $27.50 if you buy a few of them.
When I look at some of the products with a RRP of around $20.00 I have to wonder as to why people buy them .........     

sizemore

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Re: Atlas N Coil Cars
« Reply #17 on: June 26, 2014, 08:27:59 AM »
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You know what would be great, take an the IM concept of kits with drilled or marked templates, make it a snap in roof, and give me etched details to install. I have nothing better to do during football season while yelling at the poor Ravens offense.

That SP caboose would be about $35 street price if it didn't have a decoder in it for fancy lighting.

The S.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2014, 08:46:06 AM by sizemore »

Rich_S

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Re: Atlas N Coil Cars
« Reply #18 on: June 26, 2014, 09:30:48 AM »
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My biggest fear is, as prices continue to increase,  model selection and road names will decrease. Case in point, has anyone ever produced a EMD SD38-2 in N scale? From what I've heard from most manufactures is, most people today want all the bell and whistles on both rolling stock and locomotives. It seems fewer of us custom paint and decal our models and I have a hunch this is why Testors got out of the model railroad paint business. Also when I look at web sites like Microscale decals, I see them producing decals for more than just model railroads. Back in the era of the Athearn Blue Box locomotives, it was a real treat when Athearn finally released the GP38-2 and SD40-2 because they finally had scale width hoods. With paint and decals and some detail parts you could have a model of any railroads GP38-2. Today it seems everyone expects those same results right out of the box. What is the solution, I don't know?     

nkalanaga

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Re: Atlas N Coil Cars
« Reply #19 on: June 27, 2014, 01:50:35 AM »
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Another part of the problem is the cost of oil.  Besides the plastic itself, oil is needed to transport the raw materials and finished product, and in some cases, to power the factory.  The cost of oil is going up faster than inflation for several reasons, but one of the main ones is the cost of producing it.

In 1930 the average US oil field produced 100 barrels of oil for every barrel-equivalent of energy invested.  By 1970 it was about 30, and currently it's closer to 15.  It isn't that the oil is "running out", although the amount available is dropping, so much as the increased effort needed to drill deeper for less easily tapped reserves.  Eventually it will take so much energy to produce a barrel that it won't be viable.  Thus, the price rises steadily, even if other factors remain unchanged.

Incidentally, the same effect can be seen in coal.  The major problem with Appalachian coal production isn't the declining market for coal, but that all of the "easy" coal has been mined.  What's left requires either mining thin seams, often under unstable roofs, or removing entire mountain tops to surface mine.  In the meantime, Wyoming can remove some dirt and mine 100+ foot thick seams in almost flat country.  Wyoming coal may not be as good, but all power plants care about is total BTUs.  It's cheaper for many eastern utilities to haul and burn Wyoming coal, even if it takes more tons, than to mine burn the local coal.  But the world doesn't have any more "Wyoming" oil fields...
N Kalanaga
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Rich_S

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Re: Atlas N Coil Cars
« Reply #20 on: June 27, 2014, 06:14:46 AM »
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Incidentally, the same effect can be seen in coal.  The major problem with Appalachian coal production isn't the declining market for coal, but that all of the "easy" coal has been mined.  What's left requires either mining thin seams, often under unstable roofs, or removing entire mountain tops to surface mine.  In the meantime, Wyoming can remove some dirt and mine 100+ foot thick seams in almost flat country.  Wyoming coal may not be as good, but all power plants care about is total BTUs.  It's cheaper for many eastern utilities to haul and burn Wyoming coal, even if it takes more tons, than to mine burn the local coal. 

That is only half the issue, the second part of the issue is Appalachian or Eastern Bituminous coal is higher in sulfur making it harder to meet current EPA regulations. Wyoming coal is lower in sulfur content making it more desirable. As far as supply, NS just set a shipping record last year at Lambert's Point. The largest majority of the coal shipped over seas from Lambert's Point originates on the Pokey (Pocahontas Division aka Southern West Virginia) The mines with the lowest supply are the remaining Anthracite coal otherwise known as Hard Coal. These were the mines that made the eastern railroads like the CNJ, Reading, Lehigh & New England and Lehigh Valley very wealthy. But in all honestly, I think oil and coal are a stretch for the rising prices of Atlas products, my guess is China factories demanding more money for their products. Since China is still a cheap source of labor and they don't have a EPA, they can still use chemicals and paints that would be a no-no here in the States. So it's still more cost efficient for Atlas to use the China factories than to produce the products here in the states. If the trend continues, at some point China wages will equal our medium wage and it will no longer be cost efficient to use China factories, at that time industry will go looking for another country to produce their stuff. It's the same old story, after WWII they started with Eastern Europe then moved to Japan from there the move was onto Twain and Korea then Indonesia and now China, who will be next? But getting back to the original idea, as long as the majority of consumers demand contest quality models right out of the box, prices will continue to increase until another cheap source of labor is found or the up front money reaches the point that Atlas cannot afford to purchase the production run up front. Until that point, I think I'm just going to enjoy the new products being produced  :)
         


GimpLizard

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Re: Atlas N Coil Cars
« Reply #21 on: June 27, 2014, 08:25:01 AM »
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Quality, not quantity.
Quality, not quantity.
Quality, not quantity.

Oh great. NOW you tell me.

Philip H

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Re: Atlas N Coil Cars
« Reply #22 on: June 27, 2014, 11:39:42 AM »
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And considering that Klein's has them for $19.95 . . . .  :facepalm:
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fredmoehrle

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Re: Atlas N Coil Cars
« Reply #23 on: June 27, 2014, 12:24:37 PM »
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Another point on the China/environmental issue;
Look at what Marklin charges for their cars/loco's.  Germany has adopted a law that states (paraphrased) any overseas factory shipping into Germany must meet the current adopted ISO environmental standard adopted by Germany.
That's why they haven't been flooded by cheep Chinese products.
German government inspectors go over to inspect the factories, they don't take their word on it.

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Re: Atlas N Coil Cars
« Reply #24 on: June 27, 2014, 12:33:27 PM »
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Aren't India and some African countries supposed to be the "new China"?
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John

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Re: Atlas N Coil Cars
« Reply #25 on: June 27, 2014, 05:18:27 PM »
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And considering that Klein's has them for $19.95 . . . .  :facepalm:

I know that .. but I rounded up since most other dealers usually charge more thank Kleins .. so $20 street is still getting to the point of no buy for a lot of folks ..

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Re: Atlas N Coil Cars
« Reply #26 on: June 27, 2014, 07:07:08 PM »
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Another point on the China/environmental issue;
Look at what Marklin charges for their cars/loco's.  Germany has adopted a law that states (paraphrased) any overseas factory shipping into Germany must meet the current adopted ISO environmental standard adopted by Germany.
That's why they haven't been flooded by cheep Chinese products.
German government inspectors go over to inspect the factories, they don't take their word on it.

And, at the same time, Germany is a creditor nation in Europe. Hmm...

nkalanaga

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Re: Atlas N Coil Cars
« Reply #27 on: June 28, 2014, 12:25:54 AM »
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Rich:  True, sulfur is a big part of the coal issue.  But regional utilities themselves have said that the Wyoming coal is enough cheaper to make a difference, even for plants with scrubbers that can handle the extra sulfur.

And, no, oil isn't the only major issue, but it is a factor.  My point was that there are a LOT of reasons prices are going up, not just one or two that make the news/commentary regularly.
N Kalanaga
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Chris333

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Re: Atlas N Coil Cars
« Reply #28 on: June 28, 2014, 02:24:50 AM »
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From expensive model trains to cheap coal. Like sands in the hourglass.  :trollface:

Kisatchie

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Re: Atlas N Coil Cars
« Reply #29 on: June 28, 2014, 10:29:22 AM »
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From expensive model trains to cheap coal. Like sands in the hourglass.  :trollface:

Dee is another day older and deeper in debt...



Hmm... coal is so cheap, I
just bought 16 tons of it...




« Last Edit: June 28, 2014, 10:33:45 AM by Kisatchie »
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