Author Topic: N-Scale TILX Molten Sulfur Tank Car  (Read 2745 times)

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Denver Road Doug

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N-Scale TILX Molten Sulfur Tank Car
« on: February 28, 2014, 01:36:09 PM »
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Any ideas on how to kitbash/scratchbuild this car in n-scale?



A few more links to same/similar cars:
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2112806
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=3063976
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2018532

Here are the specs from rrpicturearchives.net.   The number series I'm researching (TILX 1504xx to 1507xx, see https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/108735916990594255526/albums/5730962116067447169 for what I'm trying to model.) are all either identical to this or within a small percentage variance. (for example, there is a 3" difference in height among some of the 600-series cars, and the load limit varies +/- 1000)
Owner: Trinity Industries Leasing Company
AAR Type: T104
Detail Info: Tank Cars, General Service Cars, Carbon Steel Tank (Welded or Riveted), Includes Rubber Lined.
AAR 203,203W,211A60W1,211A100W1,211J100W1.
ICC or DOT 103,103W,104W,111A60W1,111A100W1,111A100W3,111A100W4, Capacity: 12,000-18,000 gal
Plate: B
Max Gross Weight: 286000
Load Limit: 224100
Liquid Capacity: 15720
Ext L/W/H: 44'11" / 10'5" / 15'1"


I have a couple of ideas, but I don't want to skew the responses so I'll see what you guys come up with before elaborating.   I will say that I'll probably end up with 18 of them, if that makes a difference on how you would approach it.  Money is not "no object" but shouldn't be considered a major restriction either.   And, I already have full decals made so I'm already vested in the project.

Thanks for any suggestions you can provide.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2014, 01:58:29 PM by Denver Road Doug »
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Philip H

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Re: N-Scale TILX Molten Sulfur Tank Car
« Reply #1 on: February 28, 2014, 02:17:27 PM »
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Given the slight sway back I'd start with the longer of the ConCor Funnel Flows . . . . you might need to shorten it a tad and add a larger set of railings up top and a second vent.
Philip H.
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Denver Road Doug

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Re: N-Scale TILX Molten Sulfur Tank Car
« Reply #2 on: February 28, 2014, 03:55:17 PM »
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Thanks Philip for the reply.  The CC car was one that I was considering.   I'm not crazy about it for a few reasons, but it might be the best "semi-easy" route to take.  The 40ft is too short, the 46ft is too long, and both appear to be about 5-10% smaller in diameter.  Here's the stock 46ft car:



Compared to the prototype:



Compared to a photoshopped Con-Cor car, shortened and "lowered" to get as close as this car probably can get:



I don't like the ends, and not sure about how-low-can-it-go.   It's about as far out on the ledge as I would want to go before not even wasting time decaling, but it very well may be the best idea out there.   Throw some BLMA trucks, LE couplers, GMM details, and call it a day.

So what else?  :)
« Last Edit: February 28, 2014, 04:01:43 PM by Denver Road Doug »
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Philip H

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Re: N-Scale TILX Molten Sulfur Tank Car
« Reply #3 on: February 28, 2014, 03:59:58 PM »
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I think the shape of the tank ends will actually be ok, though if you wanted to sand and file a little bit you could probably get closer to the prototype profile.  I agree on your truck and coupler choices, and for GMM details, you might want to mingle from a couple of tankcar sets for your railings and such.  Perhaps a funnel flow set and an Atlas Whale tank set would give you all the parts.  You still need two valve/hatches on top - may just be a bits o' styrene sort of thing.
Philip H.
Chief Everything Officer
Baton Rouge Southern RR - Mount Rainier Division.

"Yes there are somethings that are "off;" but hey, so what." ~ Wyatt

"I'm trying to have less cranial rectal inversion with this." - Ed K.

"There's more to MRR life than the Wheezy & Nowheresville." C855B

Denver Road Doug

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Re: N-Scale TILX Molten Sulfur Tank Car
« Reply #4 on: February 28, 2014, 05:53:08 PM »
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I agree, I think a little putty and sanding will make the ends look a lot better.   The CC is definitely an option, I think.   I had originally thought that it would work as-is since the 40ft corn syrup cars look noticeably shorter to me (maybe due to diameter and/or ride height) and it would seem that only 6 more feet wouldn't make THAT much difference. (notwithstanding the fact that it would be 2ft too long in theory...it seems much more than that though)  But I'm guessing the CC 46ft may not actually be 46 scale feet, or maybe the body itself is 46ft and it's more like 52ft after porch and coupler.   (just guessing at this.)   By that reasoning, it might seem to hold that the 40ft might actually work for a car the specs out at 44ft11in.  (is that figure coupler-face to coupler-face?)  But it seems short to me from just eyeballing it.   I need to mic everything out, but I'm not where my train stash is at the moment.

So again I say....what else?   There are almost always several ways to achieve a goal....what other options are there?   My other thoughts were:
1. The Atlas 25,500.  Seems to have a slight funnel and the ends look great.  But there are some funky seams or sleeves going on that I think render it less useful.   Again, not sure what we're talking about diameter-wise either.
2. The Atlas Corn Syrup cars.   So, same line of thinking...I'm already chopping up a body shell.   Atlas corn syrup shells (Trinity 17,600) appear to be available from Atlas, for $3.45 ea so for $6.90 for two + the price of the body bolsters and maybe a couple of other details I'm in the game, versus ~$13 for the cheapest CC car I've found online. (of which I chunk trucks, couplers, details, railing, and NOT undecs so there's a alcohol bath involved)   Even if it's a wash price-wise, it's Atlas tooling versus Con-Cor.  I did e-mail Con-Cor to see if they sold the shells and bolsters as parts but so far no response.
3. Some other combination of parts or raw materials.   I think this would be tricky to get the funnel done right...I honestly have no idea though.   

One advantage...if it's frankenstein'ed enough, I would feel better about doing a mold and resin casting the lot of them.   Still might go that route and "make it right" with whomever I go with from a monetary standpoint.   I guess that makes sense to get one "right" and then cast it so I'm not prone to making mistakes over and over during the course of 18 cars.   Especially trying to cut and file and putty and sand all those joints.  I've never casted anything though, and I'm guessing that would not be a good project to start with.   I also assume it would affect how I go about building it.

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James Costello

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Re: N-Scale TILX Molten Sulfur Tank Car
« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2014, 06:08:41 PM »
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Considering you'd like a fleet, this is one of those projects where I would consider a "stand-in" approach until these are made.

I think the Atlas cars are years better than the CC, so my personal approach would be to utilise an Atlas car and decal to suit.

Probably the corn syrup cars as the seem to have the squat sort of profile.

These are a signature car for you right though Doug? So I understand if you want to get it better than a stand in.
James Costello
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Denver Road Doug

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Re: N-Scale TILX Molten Sulfur Tank Car
« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2014, 08:33:14 PM »
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These are a signature car for you right though Doug? So I understand if you want to get it better than a stand in.

No I don't really think I'd put the signature tag on them.   Just figured I'd see if there was something different than what I had in mind.   Stand-in is fine, just thought I'd see about "Stand-in Plus."   8)   I don't want Robbman yelling at me.    :P
« Last Edit: February 28, 2014, 09:31:15 PM by Denver Road Doug »
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Scottl

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Re: N-Scale TILX Molten Sulfur Tank Car
« Reply #7 on: March 02, 2014, 08:38:50 PM »
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I've always wanted a fleet of these cars.  I think the corn syrup unit is a good place to start.  I would be willing to do artwork for etched railings and other details as a contribution to the project.  The GMM detail parts might do, but if you were going to make a mold of the modified car body, might as well go all the way with it.

Denver Road Doug

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Re: N-Scale TILX Molten Sulfur Tank Car
« Reply #8 on: March 03, 2014, 11:55:11 AM »
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Scott, thanks for your interest.   That would certainly be great to have specific detail frets for this project. (and likely cheaper versus cobbling together several GMM kits eighteen times, etc.)   I would say that's a lot more pressure to come up with a correct car though versus a stand-in.   I wish I could get plans or at least more comprehensive major dimensions on this car...even tank diameter would help and I've scoured everything I can think of for that info.   I haven't posted to MFCL though, so I guess that would be the next step.
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Scottl

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Re: N-Scale TILX Molten Sulfur Tank Car
« Reply #9 on: March 03, 2014, 12:10:17 PM »
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Dimensions and better photos would definitely be a plus!  I'm happy to work with you on it and get feedback from others.  I've come to enjoy the etch work quite a bit.

GaryHinshaw

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Re: N-Scale TILX Molten Sulfur Tank Car
« Reply #10 on: March 03, 2014, 12:25:50 PM »
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Excellent prototype.  Trinity Rail used to have basic plans posted on their web site, but those now appear to be only available upon request.  Here is their page for the molten sulpher tankers.  They might be willing to send you the plans if you explain your goals.

-gfh

P.S. They offer a staggering variety of tank cars.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2014, 01:15:48 AM by GaryHinshaw »

Scottl

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Re: N-Scale TILX Molten Sulfur Tank Car
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2014, 12:37:39 PM »
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Thanks Gary, good connection. 

Does anyone have photos from above of the ends for the platforms?  There is a lot of detail in there to interpret from the photos.  I can see how much of it could be etched, but it depends how far we would want to take this.  Of course, it would need appropriate coupler housings and scale couplers  :D


GaryHinshaw

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Re: N-Scale TILX Molten Sulfur Tank Car
« Reply #12 on: March 04, 2014, 01:31:08 AM »
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If I measure the aspect ratio of the tank car in the photo, I get that the length is 4.0 times the diameter.  If I then insist that the volume of the tank cylinder be 15700 gal, I get that the length must be 35.3' and the diameter 8.7'.   (This also gives me wheels which are very close to 36", which matches the proto wheel dia.) 

The closest N scale car to this dimension is the Atlas corn syrup tanker: 35.6' length and 10.0' dia.  So it is a bit chunkier (befitting a 17K gal car) but if you hold it up to the photo, it passes the laugh test (for me anyway).  The thing I would do is to make new unloading appliances and man-way railings, then paint to suit.

The Atlas 17K chlorine tanker has a narrower body (9.2') but a longer length (42.5'), so that could be shortened to get a better match, but the banded tank and sharper ends seem more at odds with this prototype.  The Con-Cor funnel flow has about the same diameter as the corn syrup car, but is 41.6' long, so it would also have to be cut down, but it wouldn't be any closer in diameter, so it doesn't seem to be worth the trouble.

-gfh

Added: the Atlas kaolin tanker is a pretty close match for the tank size: 8.7' dia., and 36.8' len.  It somehow doesn't look as right to me as the corn syrup car though...

« Last Edit: March 04, 2014, 02:45:27 AM by GaryHinshaw »

James Costello

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Re: N-Scale TILX Molten Sulfur Tank Car
« Reply #13 on: March 04, 2014, 06:13:27 AM »
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IIRC Atlas released about a hundred* different versions of appliances/railings, so there "may" be different starting points too.





*Not quite a hundred, but maybe 3 or 4?
James Costello
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GaryHinshaw

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Re: N-Scale TILX Molten Sulfur Tank Car
« Reply #14 on: March 04, 2014, 11:26:17 AM »
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Correct.  I think the ADMX cars have the closest railings.  I took this image from the Atlas site:



and superposed it on DRD's photo for comparison, trying to match the sizing to the left truck:



The aspect ratio is definitely different, but the look and feel is similar.

-gfh