Ground Goop recipes?

[Flatrat]

Okay. Several votes for good ol' joint compound. I'm guessing the lightweight compound [blue lid]. It's plenty flexible and i thin it down to use as a skim coat on walls repairing wallpaper damage so I know how it skims. i would think the same practice would apply for smoothing over foam.

Do you add anything for texture or just tint it and get the texture from WS turf and foam? Maybe i don't need any texture in the mix since grass and weeds in n scale would be...microscopic.

[Ed Kapuscinski]

Don't add any texture. More texture would be too much texture. I'm really serious about that. In N, dirt is really, really fine. You're absolutely right.

As far as coloring goes, I just paint it once it's down.

Also, be careful with mold. I was shocked when I opened up my tub of it after not using it for a while and it was like an old loaf of bread in there.

[Flatrat]

Oh I know lot's about joint compound, drying and mold, etc. from my construction background. The best practice with joint compound or elmer's wood filler is put the lid on tight, making sure there's no dried crud on the lid or lip and then store the bucket upside down so the compound settles down on the lid. Makes it stay fresh without mold or dried clumps.

I'll experiment with thinning it down and adding ink or pigment. I think I see the wisdom of having it tinted through out the mix for adding trees or digging into it later.

[DKS]

Don't add any texture. More texture would be too much texture. I'm really serious about that. In N, dirt is really, really fine.

Yes, dirt is really fine, which is why I smooth out the Sculptamold with a spatula (you can get it pretty smooth) and then paint it with dirt-colored paint. But dirt--as in the kind we walk around upon or may see exposed--is not everywhere. Soil in natural areas is hardly smooth at all; and since it's almost always covered with some kind of vegetation (at least in most areas of the country), the point of the Sculptamold's roughness is moot.

Here's some "dirt" of the kind you might make with spackle:



Now here is some plain old natural soil. Doesn't look so smooth any more.



And here's a marvelous image showing them side-by-side:



I've found it a lot easier to make Sculptamold smooth than to make spackle naturally textured--heck, I've even paved streets with the stuff--





All of those streets are Sculptamold tinted with some black dye. Oh, and there's some nice, smooth dirt in the first image, lower left, where the wheelbarrow is.

[Lemosteam]

The best practice with joint compound or elmer's wood filler is put the lid on tight, making sure there's no dried crud on the lid or lip and then store the bucket upside down so the compound settles down on the lid. Makes it stay fresh without mold or dried clumps.

Flatrat, now that is a great tip. 

Did a VERY quick 10"X10" no-scale diorama with my daughter (we had 2 days to complete) for a school project and other than making smooth surfaces such as roads and sidewalks, or making hollow hillsides, I see no need for anything other than paint over the foam, unless some deep gouges or gaps require filling.  I simply filed the foam smooth with a coarse metal file to sculpt and used some old latex paint to cover the pink.  Lightweight compound or not it just seems like unnecessary weight and time spent coating something that is going to be coated again anyway with paint, sand, ground foam or grass.

[Flatrat]

I'm modeling rather lush rolling foothills farm fields and streams of north central MD in the 1940s. Just painting a flat foam board isn't going to cut it. I will need to use some kind of goop to smooth all the joints between layers and transitions in the foam. I already have joint compound so I'm going to try some experiments on scrap foam with that first. If I don't like that I'll head to the store for sculptamold or something else.

The other tip I've learned over the years with pre-mixed joint compound is dump a couple of big scoops in your mud tray and then thin it down with water to a consistency somewhere between smooth peanut butter and mayonaise. It seems like many people think there's a law against not using it straight from the tub. Thinned down a bit it works so much better and seems to require little or even no sanding sometimes.

Another feature of joint compound over plasters is after it's dry, before being painted, you can soften it back up with water and smooth it around with a sponge instead of getting dust all over from sanding.

[Ed Kapuscinski]

David, while I can't argue with your absolutely correct observation (and the stellar work that proves the technique), my point is that even that soil photo would still be "smooth" if you scaled it down to N scale.

[mmagliaro]

I used to use plaster or joint compound.  Compound works well, and it's cheap.   It never took stains or washes well for me,
not like plaster does.  You can paint it just fine.

On this layout, I tried Celluclay.  It's about $25 for a 5 lb bag at Michael's Crafts, and it goes quite a long way.  It's really just
pre-ground paper pulp for paper mache.  You can get it in gray or white.  The gray doesn't bother me, since I am
painting and ground foaming over it anyway.   

Downsides: It takes days to dry.  It's not dirt cheap (ha ha).

But it's so easy to work with, dries very strong and lightweight, and isn't too hard to punch a hole through for a tree, etc.
I wouldn't use it for places where you need really smooth surfaces.  But for rolling terrain and mountains, it's great.
I'd use it again.

[Bob Bufkin]

David, sorry to change the subject but what is that White River unit in your photo.  Kinda looks like an Alco but looks like a steamer cab?

[Ian MacMillan]

Also, be careful with mold. I was shocked when I opened up my tub of it after not using it for a while and it was like an old loaf of bread in there.

Did you add the Lysol? Its in the Sassi recipe and pretty much a must if you aren't going to use it all right off.

[C855B]

Did you add the Lysol? Its in the Sassi recipe and pretty much a must if you aren't going to use it all right off.

My wife is the "mudder" in this family; we're perpetually in some manner of house renovation mode. She solved the mold issue completely by leveling and smoothing the leftovers in the pail and covering them with Saran Wrap. Even in a sealed bucket, it's the air space that gets ya'.

[PAL_Houston]

...

I've found it a lot easier to make Sculptamold smooth than to make spackle naturally textured--heck, I've even paved streets with the stuff--

Yes, but what caught my attention was the Pinto parked in the side of the garbage truck, in the middle of an intersection.  The police have arrived, and a crowd has collected.

Quintesstential 1970's.  Gas is still 79.9 per gallon.

Oh, and the dirt looks good too!!

[pnolan48]

I used joint compound, and wasn't afraid to add just about anything into it, although only water based paints or stains. I mixed it up only partially, so it went on in streaks and blotches. If I didn't like it, a quick swipe of more mud just covered it over. My generic cover was a mid tan-brown latex paint. Drilling holes for trees left a white mound, which I vacuumed away. There was still white residue, which I retouched tan-brown.

Joint compound isn't really all that heavy. You can work it for a long time. And it sets up with enough rigidity that I don't worry about scenery failures of any sort, except a flood.

[davefoxx]

Joint compound isn't really all that heavy.

This is why I like it.  Helps keep the layout portable.

[DKS]

David, while I can't argue with your absolutely correct observation (and the stellar work that proves the technique), my point is that even that soil photo would still be "smooth" if you scaled it down to N scale.

It all comes down to "how big should a scale brick be?" Scale soil, to my eye, tends to look like paint instead of soil. If you take just a teeny bit of liberty with the scale of surface details, they read better to the eye. Ballast is the same way--scale cinders for a yard, again, looks like paint instead of cinders.

For my first NZT structure kit, I rendered the bricks exactly to scale. And you know what? I'm not head over heels about it; I have this temptation to make them just a tad larger--not much, just enough so they read as bricks better.

IMO, of course, and we're all different when it comes to this.

David, sorry to change the subject but what is that White River unit in your photo.  Kinda looks like an Alco but looks like a steamer cab?

That's an RS-1, first gen Atlas.