Tehachapi, BC

[C855B]

Ben, if you read way back in this thread, my Mojave dig is sort of an inside joke. I'm a genuine Mojave native, an increasingly rare bird... hospital closed around 1958.

I wouldn't want to live there, either. Gary, ever since White's Cafe closed I really haven't been all that fired-up about visiting. No family there, they've scattered to the winds... hey... another Mojave joke.

[GaryHinshaw]

Very little time for trains this week, but I did manage to get out yesterday and pick up some Tortoises and related power supplies and switches, so I rigged up this contraption in the lab:



[I'm just posting this shot for its esthetic value.   ]  Happily, the first test worked perfectly, so I think I know enough to push forward when I get some time. One thing I found helpful was to switch to slightly thinner wire for the throw-bar link (0.019 stainless).  This seems to have plenty of spring and will fit the small PC board throw-bars nicely.   I opted for a dual power supply that gives me +/-12 V, so all I need are SPDT switches down the line for polarity switching.   Other than that, the biggest challenge going forward will be getting the machines into some cramped spots.  They seem pretty bullet-proof though, and it's nice not to have to fiddle with limiting the throw.  With the adjustable fulcrum and the springy wire, you just mount it and forget about it.

One step closer to finishing the upper deck track installation...

-gfh

[GaryHinshaw]

This morning I tried out a control panel option for the turnout switches.  On the upper deck I'm planning to have mini-panels near the siding and switching areas and I'm thinking of mounting them just under the fascia (since they are small, and the deck spacing is largish, ~20").  Here is a quick mock-up of the Walong siding panel (Walong is the Loop siding):




For now I'm mostly focused on ergonomic questions: is this a convenient location? is it simple to understand and use?  is it out of the way of errant elbows? 

I think it's pretty obvious how to read the turnout positions, and I like that the toggles don't stick out beyond the fascia plane, but they're still easy to reach, so I think I'll wire this up and live with it for a bit.  If I like it, I'll swap in a better looking panel.  Comments/suggestions welcome.

-gfh

[wazzou]

Gary -
With your woodworking skill, I would router out slight recessions right in the fascia for the toggles and just put the map/trackage arrangement on there as well. 
It will look cleaner and less like an afterthought.

[Scottl]

Clever use of the split power supply, I like that a lot.  I would tend to agree as well that building the panel into the fascia would look better, and even with 20"ish of clearance, why potentially ruin the sight lines with a panel?  Regardless, your experiments look better than the final product in many cases.

[GaryHinshaw]

Good comments.  I'm all for clean lines and will keep that in mind when it's time for a permanent solution.  (This was literally a 45 min hack job this am.)  Bryan, do you have an example in mind of a panel you especially like?  One detail I always pay attention to when I go to a museum (aside from the paintings  ) is the captioning that is applied directly to the plaster walls.    I could dig a treatment like that for the schematics on the fascia.

Scott, the bi-polar power supply seemed like the simplest and most intuitive one of the schemes in the Tortoise instructions.  It's especially simple here because you can keep these stall motors under constant voltage.

All of this is a way to buy time while I work up the courage to permanently mount some turnouts.  I want to have the supporting infrastructure worked out so I can finally finish the upper deck track work!

-gfh

[robert3985]

Good comments.  I'm all for clean lines and will keep that in mind when it's time for a permanent solution.   I could dig a treatment like that for the schematics on the fascia.

All of this is a way to buy time while I work up the courage to permanently mount some turnouts.  I want to have the supporting infrastructure worked out so I can finally finish the upper deck track work!

-gfh

Gary,

I don't know what your parameters are for your front fascia, nor for your control panels, but here is what I am doing with my turnout controls, and I haven't seen it done anywhere else.

Since my modular layout goes to shows three times a year (all of it sometimes, a portion of it sometimes) it gets transported, which is always hard on modules no matter how careful I am in packing them up and bracing them.

Also, when I'm at a show, I don't want anybody leaning over the rope and throwing a turnout that I don't know about...just for sh*ts and giggles.

When I'm set up at home, I also don't want to be catching my shirt or sleeves on protruding DPDT toggles sticking out from my fascia.

One of my parameters for building my modules using about 90% permanent layout benchwork is to incorporate flowing fascia along the front for a pleasing and artistic appearance.  I really don't want to recess big panels in my fascia which would (in my opinion) draw attention to the front fascia and detract from its aesthetic appeal.

So...after much experimentation over the years with removable panels, and a lot of what I've written about in the previous paragraphs, I decided to go for a "minimalist" approach for turnout control, following several logical assumptions and practices.

When you look at Echo Yard and the adjacent Park City Branchline Yard, you won't see any turnout controls on the fascia.  It appears smooth and flowing and is interrupted only by the Digitrax Loconet panels on each module and a throttle holder.

If you look closer, you'll see there are several small standard screws that are countersunk a little into the fascia, each with its slot in a vertical position, and all the same height from the bottom of the fascia.

Here's a photo of the west end of Echo Yard and the fascia with screws (you have to look closely in this photo to see them since they're painted the same color as the fascia)


You'll see my hand in the photo, and I'm throwing a switch.

How do I know which switch I'm throwing without a diagram in front of me?  I locate each DPDT toggle switch by laying a straightedge perpendicular from the turnout headblocks to the facia edge, drill the mounting hole through the fascia (2" up from the bottom edge) and use a small Stanley 1" metal zinc plated corner brace on the inside of my fascia to mount my DPDT (center off) toggle switch.

So, when I need to throw a turnout, I simply let my eye travel from the switch headblocks to whatever screw head is on the front fascia that is perpendicular to that particular turnout's throwbar.

I also arrange every DPDT toggle switch so that when the toggle is positioned LEFT, the switch is aligned NORMAL.

I use center off DPDT toggle switches so I can have control of where the points are positioned if I have to repair them.

Here's a photo of the backside of my fascia with the toggle switches mounted and wired up.


Here's another.  As you can see, I use thick CA to sock the wires down on the inside of the front fascia where appropriate.


It's really simple to just walk along the edge of the layout and flick each toggle to the left (or feel which way it's positioned) to make sure all the turnouts are routed NORMAL.  Of course, I can look at the switch points too, or the target of my switchstands when I get them installed, but it can be done in a totally tactile manner, and I find myself doing this more since I repositioned the toggle switches to LEFT = NORMAL.

Mounting the toggle switches up and out of the way, but being readily available keeps them from getting broken off during transit, or thrown by snagging them or by a prankster at a show.

I've also thought about mounting LEDs to visually indicate the switch point position without having to use a finger to feel the toggle, and I've also thought about painting a schematic on the fascia, but I haven't had any difficulty aligning turnouts without one...and neither have my guest operators.

And, I kinda like the minimalist approach.

Maybe this will give you something to think about in planning for permanently installing your turnouts and their accompanying controls.

[mark dance]

Gary, like your Tehachapi layout, the C&W uses small panels to mount the toggles to throw upper benchwork turnouts (of course as you know).  There are pros and cons.  One con I have continually bumped in to is not having enough room to represent everything every operator would like on the panel.  I don't know if your panels will be for more or less complicated trackage than the C&W (my guess is somewhat less) but if I had to do it again I would have:

- used a free form rather than linear graphic style
- used smaller LEDs to indicate direction rather than the large ones.  Yes I would retain the LEDs as it is easy to see from a distance in low light what direction the routes are set. 
- put the toggles directly in the turnout schematic as you are doing
- investigated a routed or laser cut panel material (I think Tim Horton has a nice solution here) rather than the decal system I used
- left space to name tracks and industries

Here are some of the early panels from a photo which is *6 years old* now!  I have redesigned most of them to be more intuitive but the style was retained.  I am also using a different connector system now then the 8 pin phone jacks I used on the early panels and I am gradually replacing those connectors when I need to.



I am still wondering if I should have used a higher contrast colour scheme rather than the more muted Tuscan and Grey scheme.

Happy to chat live should that be valuable.

md

[Zox]

Just to toss another appearance option in, here are the power-routing panels for my two straight modules:



These are black computer printing on yellow paper, laminated with "prism-pattern" contact paper and mounted to 1/8" hardboard.

Since they're on modules, they're designed to fold under the module inside the frame when not in use.

[GaryHinshaw]

Bob, that's a very innovative approach that might work for me.  I appreciate the input, and especially enjoy seeing the behind-the-scenes photos.  Without any experience to go by, my concern would be that this is a bit too subtle for guest operators, especially in a setting where the turnouts are somewhat far from the fascia, and so could be tricky to correlate.  I'm open-minded though!

md, thanks for the photo!  Of course your panel placement has influenced my thinking.  FWIW, your layout is straightforward (and a joy) to operate.  There are one or two spots where I have to look twice to see that I've thrown the proper turnout, and a more literal depiction could indeed be useful, but that's just nit-picking.   (Also, for the life of me, I was trying to remember how you arranged the toggles in your panels  - I was going to shoot you an email, but you saved me the time).  I'm not familiar with Tim's panel, so I'll ping him about that. 

Zox, I like the simplicity of your graphics.  I'm tempted to print something too.  I was thinking the Walong panel would look good (and be less confusing) if the actual Loop were printed, straight from the CAD plan.

Thanks folks, I love it that I can pop a question out here and get half a dozen thoughtful responses in under a day.  Very helpful!

[James Costello]

Gary, I need to get a photo for you of the set-up my Dad is using with the Tam Valley Depot servo's, a slide out hidden panel for the wiring and track diagram. I'll try and get out there in the next few days and grab one for you.

[GaryHinshaw]

Please do James.  So far I'm sold on the Tortoise for its simplicity, ruggedness, and track record, but there are a few spots (at least) where size is a problem. For example, summit switch which is right in the middle of the doorway: there I'll either need remote mounting or a smaller drive.

-gfh

[ednadolski]

Gary, are you planning to do working signals?   Does that affect any of the wiring at this stage?  IIRC and FWIW, the Tortoise has an extra set of contacts for driving signals.

(I'd love to do lighted signals for my shelf layout, but I don't have much idea where to start.  I sure wish I could get those old Sunrise parts, or that the BLMA N scale signals would release soon.)


Ed

[Sokramiketes]

I like Bob's solution too since Modutrak is all about mininalism.  We went a slightly different route with flush mounted RCA jacks.  In essence, we use the RCA jacks as a toggle switch without a permanent toggle.  A shorted out RCA plug is the toggle which goes with the operator, means the public can't throw turnouts at shows, and adds that element of having a "switch key".





Bill Denton has written about the wiring twice (once in NSR which has an error in the diagram - look in the following month for a correction- and once in RMC July 2012)

Basically we use a single power supply and power pins 1 and 8 at all times through a resistor.  Then we run ground through the RCA jacks to pin 1 and 8.  Inserting a switch key completes the ground side of the circuit and allows power to flow one of the possible directions and run the motor in the Tortoise.  Red for Reverse and White for Normal is our RCA convention. 

What's nice for us is that once the key is removed the Tortoise doesn't siphon power anymore.  Keeps out power needs lower on a large layout. 

[John]

you guys see this one?