PRR/Conrail Juniata Division Engineering Report

[Dave V]

So now, when I am least resourced to do it, the Juniata Division is forcing the issue of track replacement.

Just a few months after I completed the mountains over the tunnel back in 2006, a kink developed on the inside track inside the tunnel.  Probably a cold solder joint.  Either way, I pulled out the offending flex track and replaced the hidden trackage with Kato Unitrack.  Thank God I'd put in an access panel.  All went swimmingly.

Fast forward 5 years.  After two moves, a bunch of shows, and nearly every climate the CONUS can impart upon a layout, the spliced joint between the Unitrack and the original flex has spread on the outside rail.  I have no idea how I managed to solder that joint in the first place given where it is (buried just out of reach between the portal and access panel), but now, without removing the yard portion and causing significant trauma, I'm not sure how I can fix it.  The net result is that locomotives lose traction in that joint and stall briefly when under heavy load.

SO...

Let me bounce an idea.  If I wanted to ensure an absolutely smooth curve with a constant radius, what if I used code 55 sectional?  Hear me out.  Both radii I use are commercially available.  Given how tight they are (13.75" on the inside), any variation in curvature will cause equipment problems.  Lastly, since I'm replacing track on a scenicked layout, the old yardstick on a pivot trick (which is how I first laid the curves) won't be possible.

So, with soldered joints, I wonder if sectional track on the curves will work.

[wm3798]

What if you took a sharpie and traced the old track before you pulled it out?  Or is it too late for that kind of simplistic approach?
L

[Dave V]

That will be difficult in the tunnel, although I think I'm resigned to temporarily daylighting it as I work.

I'm less worried about the general radius as I am about imperceptible kinks and such.  I don't know that tracing with a Sharpie will give me the precision I need at this point for my steamies.  Moreover, there are a few minor radius changes elsewhere that I want to remove.

Are soldered sectional track segments a problem?  One set of curves would be buried in a tunnel, and the other in a deep cut.  So the visual fart of the sectional joints should be less visible.

[John]

Are soldered sectional track segments a problem?  One set of curves would be buried in a tunnel, and the other in a deep cut.  So the visual fart of the sectional joints should be less visible.

Not if you file the solder joints smooth - make it look like a section of flex .. I use sectional in some spots, and have had no problems, if you make sure the solder joints are smooth ..

[wcfn100]

I don't know how well this would work, but an idea I had about laying flex on a curve is to pull the sliding rail and put it through a rail bender then slide it back into the flex.  There would no doubt be bend back, but maybe there's a way to make it all work.  ???


Jason

[Dave V]

I don't know how well this would work, but an idea I had about laying flex on a curve is to pull the sliding rail and put it through a rail bender then slide it back into the flex.  There would no doubt be bend back, but maybe there's a way to make it all work.  ???


Jason

That sounds rather more complicated and less precise than simply using sectional.

Since N scale trains are so terribly unforgiving of track defects, I'm inclined to swallow pride and do what it takes to ensure flawless operation.

[DKS]

I think using sectional is perfectly fine. For one layout of mine that has handlaid track in the visible areas, I used sectional in the tunnels. Never had a stitch of trouble, and it was much faster/easier than a similar layout I'd built earlier using flex.

[davefoxx]

Dr. Dave,

The way I see it you've got two options:

1) Sectional track, which I think will work well, IF you can build a radius similar to the existing radii.  Otherwise, this will be problematic to maintain clearance to the tunnel walls and between tracks.  If you can create a radius similar to the Kato Unitrack, this is probably what I would try first.  I would absolutely solder the sections together and fish the curve through the completed tunnel.  However, I see a problem.  Are you leaving the Unitrack in place and gluing the sectional on top or are you somehow fishing that track out?  If the former, will you have height clearance issues to the tunnel ceiling and/or tunnel portals?  If the latter, how will you install subroadbed in the tunnel?  Also, securing the track will require some creativity.

2) Cut the hilltop off.  I wouldn't be hesitant to do this with a hot knife, which would make a clean cut, allowing you to replace the hill with a minimal scar to repair.  Then, you could get in there and use any track you prefer.

I still think my idea of just installing code 55 on top of your code 80 and burying the old track with ballast (you could even solder feeders to the old track before burying it) could possibly work, except that I know we have discussed that raising the track on the river bridge is not esthetically possible.  'Tis a shame, because that would allow you to address the track in the tunnel and upgrade to code 55 at the same time, with minimal destruction to the existing layout.

Hope this helps,
DFF

[BOK]

Hi Dave:

In the past i have used Atlas Code 55, section track and never had a problem with it.
I never needed to to solder any joints either. Also Atlas offers many different curve
radius's so you should be able to find something which works.

Barry

[Dave V]

Dave,

I will have to carve the mountain.  Replacing the track completely allows me to rip out that POS WS Trackbed.  It's easy to work with but too soft for precise trackwork.

[wm3798]

Scenery is easy to fix.  Bad trackwork, not so much.  Take a knife to it.

Lee

[davefoxx]

Dave,

I will have to carve the mountain.  Replacing the track completely allows me to rip out that POS WS Trackbed.  It's easy to work with but too soft for precise trackwork.

Dave,

What did you use to glue down the WS roadbed?  Will it come free without leaving the underlying foam a mess?  I use yellow wood glue to glue cork roadbed to the foam, and, for the most part, it will pop free with minimal damage.

Just curious,
DFF

[Dave V]

Dave,

I think there's a small part done with latex caulk, but the majority is laid with white glue.  It will come up, but it has a tendency to disintegrate rather than come up cleanly.  When it's all done I think I'll have a relatively flat surface for the cork.  There are a few spots where there is currently no track that will need sand-and-fill to receive new track (such as the front of Lewistown where the eastbound platforms are).  If you've noticed I don't have a lot of purely flat spaces on the layout as Pennsylvania isn't flat even where it's "flat."

This scene will change to a 3-track line and no eastbound platform (on the right):



The good news is that Atlas offers sectional in all the curve radii that I'm concerned about.

[MichaelWinicki]

I don't think you're going to have much trouble getting the WS Roadbed to lift off. 

I've relocated enough trackwork/WS Roadbed on my layout (which was adhered with white glue) that I've learned that it's not a big issue.

[Bsklarski]

SO...

Let me bounce an idea.  If I wanted to ensure an absolutely smooth curve with a constant radius, what if I used code 55 sectional?  Hear me out.  Both radii I use are commercially available.  Given how tight they are (13.75" on the inside), any variation in curvature will cause equipment problems.  Lastly, since I'm replacing track on a scenicked layout, the old yardstick on a pivot trick (which is how I first laid the curves) won't be possible.

So, with soldered joints, I wonder if sectional track on the curves will work.

I used sectional track on my layout. I was very, very hesitant to do so, but I am happy that I did. All my kato E8s and Kato passeger cars run smoothly. I have not had a single issue yet. The track is glue down with liquid nails on cork roadbed, which is on plywood. Its rock solid

Brian