What Tank Car

[sirenwerks]

It's 1977, what prototype of tank car would be appropriate for hauling coal tar? Coal tar is a byproduct of the coke making process and its distillation byproducts were chemicals used in roof and road waterproofing, stock feeds and fertilizers, coatings and dyes, wood treatments, etc.
Koppers was the biggest producer of coal tar through that time, with Reilly Industries, Allied Signal, and Aristech Chemical being some others. Koppers had 34 ACF 8K type 27s to haul coal tar starting in the late 30s, but I don't think they would still be hanging on in the end of the 70s (Addendum: they were gone by 1962) and my research has turned up bupkis buttkiss (sp?) on what type of newer tank car design was being used.
Does anyone else have knowledge of what tank cars were used to haul coal tar in the later 1970s?

[C855B]

The word you're looking for is "bupkis". It's Yiddish for "nothing". The Niles character frequently used it in episodes of Frasier.

I wouldn't dismiss current practice hauling coal tar in conventional cars. Might be too heavy, I dunno, but I occasionally see "everyday" tank cars with "HOT" placards that would infer heavy distillates like that. I'm no freight car expert, but they're usually just one or two of a string of similar cars containing anhydrous ammonia, sodium hydroxide, or hydrochloric acid.

Our most frequent eating-out venue is next to three mainlines. I'll occasionally scare my wife reading the contents markings if the train is passing slow enough. 

[Mark5]

Koppers used ACF 8K type 27s to haul coal tar starting in the late 30s, but I don't think they would still be hanging on in the end of the 70s a

Yeah, from what I've dug around on this is that the KPCX 1550-1583 Koppers 8K coal tar tanks were all out of service by the sixties.

I have a parallel interest in this as there was and still is a Koppers plant just west of Roanoke.

I have a collection of pix of newer Koppers tanks, but a none of them specifically say Coal Tar in large letters (many of them are covered in black filth, so who knows?).

This Koppers tank from 1987 does say Pitch on the side, but I think that is a Coal Tar byproduct: https://canadianfreightcargallery.ca/cgi-bin/image.pl?i=kpcx660&o=kpcx

[sirenwerks]

Yeah, from what I've dug around on this is that the KPCX 1550-1583 Koppers 8K coal tar tanks were all out of service by the sixties.

I have a parallel interest in this as there was and still is a Koppers plant just west of Roanoke.

I have a collection of pix of newer Koppers tanks, but a none of them specifically say Coal Tar in large letters (many of them are covered in black filth, so who knows?).

This Koppers tank from 1987 does say Pitch on the side, but I think that is a Coal Tar byproduct: https://canadianfreightcargallery.ca/cgi-bin/image.pl?i=kpcx660&o=kpcx

Koppers' 1930s cars had a three color logo on them, looked kinda classy. Pitch is the heaviest byproduct of the coal tar refinement process, basically asphalt and roofing-grade bitumen, hence the heater on that tank, to keep it from solidifying inside the car. It's denser than coal tar too, so the fact that Koppers was using cars larger than 8K in the 80s may mean it was using larger cars in the 70s too, maybe of the 1948 10K design like Walthers makes in HO.

I'm looking to add a small chemical distillery to process coal tar. There's a modern version not far from me on the banks of the Columbia River, which focuses on explosives. But a distillation plant wouldn't be too hard to knock off because they're not always that big or complicated, and would mean lots of tank cars. Lots of coal tar in and a variety of tank cars out to handle the different byproducts, ranging from light ethels to bitumen sludge. With the possibility of interior layout movements too, like a timber treating facility, a paint plant, or an asphalt contractor. Or maybe I will just relocate the GAF roofing tile plant in Baltimore I used to love so much, to Oregon.

[sirenwerks]

Yeah, from what I've dug around on this is that the KPCX 1550-1583 Koppers 8K coal tar tanks were all out of service by the sixties.

I have a parallel interest in this as there was and still is a Koppers plant just west of Roanoke.

I have a collection of pix of newer Koppers tanks, but a none of them specifically say Coal Tar in large letters (many of them are covered in black filth, so who knows?).

This Koppers tank from 1987 does say Pitch on the side, but I think that is a Coal Tar byproduct: https://canadianfreightcargallery.ca/cgi-bin/image.pl?i=kpcx660&o=kpcx

I made an inquiry on a Facebook group I am a member of and got a response with images of two cars. I don't have details on them yet, but here are the pics:

Taken 1969, location unknown. Car built in 1940s.Similar to the Goodyear car Steve Holzheimer created.

Photo taken in the 1970s or 80s, likely, location unknown. Car built in 1968.

[Mark5]

Nice - I'm guessing that pic of 3016 is from "A Rolling Pipeline of Colorful Tank Cars: Classic Freight Cars Vol.2" p.50.

10K tank 1948. The other piece of data (I didn't have the book or the pic) is they are series 3000-3074. Homepoint: Folansbee, W.Va. (this data might have been in the caption for the photo).

I got the above info from some forum (I forget which one ). I need to check my 1974 ORER to what was still on the rails then.

[sirenwerks]

Nice - I'm guessing that pic of 3016 is from "A Rolling Pipeline of Colorful Tank Cars: Classic Freight Cars Vol.2" p.50.

10K tank 1948. The other piece of data (I didn't have the book or the pic) is they are series 3000-3074. Homepoint: Folansbee, W.Va. (this data might have been in the caption for the photo).

I got the above info from some forum (I forget which one ). I need to check my 1974 ORER to what was still on the rails then.

If you find more info in the ORER, please post.

[Mark5]

Well, yeah 



July 1974 ORER

[sirenwerks]

I expected one of the home sites would be the St Paul MN coke plant, which didn't shut down until '79, IIRC. Hmmm...

[Mark5]

To add to the Koppers info/mystery I have in my collection a photo of KPCX 3121 (from the number range 3102-3309) - marked as COAL TAR CHEMICALS (but with no platform).

I have several other photos from that range, but they all have platforms (they appear to be the same design as the 3000-3074 tanks).