HEP Car questions

[delamaize]

Hey everyone,
So more Skookumchuck Beltline content comming, so if youre sick of my railroad, feel free to tune out now.

So, passenger service on my line is just 2 RDCs, and one private, presidential/inspection car. In my world, we have an interchange agreement between the NP/GN/UP/MILW, with the private car. The agreement says we just have to move it to the interchange track at Blumauer interchange/yard, or Koppen interchange/Yard, and they take it from there.

This is where the question comes in. SBL doesnt have any locomotives that have HEP, or generation/steamheat hardware. I'm looking at building a HEP/Steam generator/power car to use with the private car when its being moved, or used along the line. Was there any kind of standardized design, or rules/regulations for building these? Or was it more AdHoc and built by each railroad to their own standards/needs? Right now, Im planning on using an old cheapo 50 Ft boxcar, and just modifying/detailing it, but I want this to be believable. Also, were these cars in captive service? Or would they be interchangeable? Was/Is there any kid of safety things that were identifiable from the exterior that I would need to add as detail? What about trucks? Freight rollerbearing trucks ok? Or do I need to use something more passenger orientated? Also, for the water tank for the boiler, were these inside the car somewhere, or would they have been external, maybe below the floor type tanks?

I appreciate any information I can get for this. Google has been less than helpful

[learmoia]

Probably Ad-Hoc..

HEP in a baggage car
https://www.hebners.net/Amtrak/amtGG1900/amt906b.jpg

Or Boxcar
https://nevadasouthern.com/equipment/head-end/

Steam Heat in an F7
https://www.railpictures.net/photo/827414/

but I'm also wondering if you REALLY need one..... or could the car have a generator/battery setup to run solo.

Like.. how did this work?
https://www.railpictures.net/photo/640414/

CR1933 didn't have HEP..
There was an HEP Boxcar but it wasn't ways used...

[Dupesy]

The other thing to consider is, does it need a separate car for HEP?  Many private cars are set up with their own on-board generators and can run independently on that OR use train-supplied HEP.

[Rasputen]

Here is a C&O steam generator car, built from a troop sleeper:

[Iain]

[ Guests cannot view attachments ]

Atlantic and East Carolina built this car so they could heat Pullmans after they retired their steam.

[milw156]

What year are you operating in? I was under the impression that HEP did not become widespread, other than commuter ops such as RTA/Metra, until well into Amtrak. If you are interchanging with the roads you mentioned, HEP would have been the odd man out.

[nickelplate759]

Probably Ad-Hoc..

HEP in a baggage car
https://www.hebners.net/Amtrak/amtGG1900/amt906b.jpg

Or Boxcar
https://nevadasouthern.com/equipment/head-end/

Steam Heat in an F7
https://www.railpictures.net/photo/827414/

but I'm also wondering if you REALLY need one..... or could the car have a generator/battery setup to run solo.

Like.. how did this work?
https://www.railpictures.net/photo/640414/

CR1933 didn't have HEP..
There was an HEP Boxcar but it wasn't ways used...

I'm pretty sure that Amtrak HEP-a-baggage car was an ACF Troop Kitchen car before it was a baggage car.

[jjb62556]

Check out Scaletraxx. They have many shells for head end power units.

[nkalanaga]

I'm with Dupesy.  Install a generator in the private car, and HEP connections on the ends.  When running in a freight train, it would use the onboard generator, which wouldn't take up that much room.  It should fit nicely under the floor.  In a passenger train, it would run off the train's HEP.

[Rasputen]

I think the point of the OP is that he wants to have a separate HEP car for operational purposes.  Sounds like fun!

[delamaize]

Thank you for all the information everybody. To answer one question, I'm looking at doing an Hep car as a separate entity for a few reasons. One of them is my layout is going to be multi-generational,, and I'm trying to come up with something that would be feasible and believable from as early as 1940 all the way through the late 90s.

Another reason why I'm looking at doing a separate car, simply is for the project. I really do enjoy kit bashing and scratch building, and I believe I have a car that would make a good starting point that is not something I would normally use. Also as somebody said before, operationally I think it would be fun when I get to the point where I can have operations. Right now my layout is very much a plywood Prairie with some small scenery. I have a few pictures on the layout engineering report forum. I really do need to get off my butt and get some scenery finished though. The entire layout is modular, built Loosely to oNe Trak standards, with some Liberties taken. All of my modules have the optional second line/passing siding, so i can create a loop.

Another reason I want to do an Hep car as a separate unit, is for the storyline for the railroad. I figure I can put a dedicated siding at each station, that would be for parking the Hep car to use as a stationary generator in the event of power outages. I don't know just playing with ideas. As I start to build I'll start another thread and keep people updated

[nickelplate759]

Thank you for all the information everybody. To answer one question, I'm looking at doing an Hep car as a separate entity for a few reasons. One of them is my layout is going to be multi-generational,, and I'm trying to come up with something that would be feasible and believable from as early as 1940 all the way through the late 90s.

Another reason why I'm looking at doing a separate car, simply is for the project. I really do enjoy kit bashing and scratch building, and I believe I have a car that would make a good starting point that is not something I would normally use. Also as somebody said before, operationally I think it would be fun when I get to the point where I can have operations. Right now my layout is very much a plywood Prairie with some small scenery. I have a few pictures on the layout engineering report forum. I really do need to get off my butt and get some scenery finished though. The entire layout is modular, built Loosely to oNe Trak standards, with some Liberties taken. All of my modules have the optional second line/passing siding, so i can create a loop.

Another reason I want to do an Hep car as a separate unit, is for the storyline for the railroad. I figure I can put a dedicated siding at each station, that would be for parking the Hep car to use as a stationary generator in the event of power outages. I don't know just playing with ideas. As I start to build I'll start another thread and keep people updated

In the 1940s through the 1960s, a steam-generator car would have been what would be used. Some time in the 1970s it would make sense to cut over to an HEP car.   How do you feel about making two cars?

[cv_acr]

Ontario Northland had old F7B units that were rebuilt as EGUs. Also at least one old GMDD steam generator that was rebuilt as an EGU.

GO Transit had F7s rebuilt to "APCU" (cab-control and HEP power units).

Ontario Northland now has a pair of ex-F40PH rebuilt to APCUs.

Many executive trains use old baggage cars rebuilt as generators.

CN used a baggage car rebuilt as a generator back in the 1970s to replace the HEP that was lost in one of their "Tempo" RS-18s that got wrecked.

[seusscaboose]

speaking from personal experience

do the HEP car

build into your scenario that the PV has a genset under it... but it was an old 120V/60Hz generator...  so you need a 50hz Cat unit in the power car to power any visiting PV that do not have their own gen set's for 50Hz power.  In your scenario you could have PV's visiting to have running maintenance / etc..   it is a nice form of income to keep your shops busy in the winter months..

by the way...  yes.... the PV would surely have a gen set under it...  especially since it is the Presidents car...  (I've ran from NYC to CHI on a genset in my personal experience to ensure I didn't freeze up in the winter on the Lake Shore Limited when i was cut out in CHI - just in case my genset didn't start int he cold weather...  despite having all kinds of heat protection...  always better safe than sorry... especially in PV world)

[nkalanaga]

"In the 1940s through the 1960s, a steam-generator car would have been what would be used"

Usually, but the CB&Q had HEP for commuter trains by 1950.  I believe that C&NW also had some commuter HEP.  So, it would be at least plausible.

I'd use a short baggage car, and install the generator in one end.  The rest of the car could be used for supplies, tools, or whatever was needed.