Author Topic: Western Railcraft passenger car rebuilds  (Read 1112 times)

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randgust

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Western Railcraft passenger car rebuilds
« on: February 07, 2025, 01:15:43 PM »
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OK, so I've had my trading post thing up there for quite a while, and have managed now to snag a baggage/RPO car, two coaches, and I have my original "Mayflower" observation that goes back to about 1979.

For somebody that hasn't been in N scale since the 1970's, these are a classic, yet primitive kit.   Brass etchings, some wire, maybe some window material, some wood shapes including a roof.   Next best thing to scratchbuilding.  The redeeming part is that they made stuff that NOBODY else did,the line of early 1900's vestibule passenger cars with truss rods, wood sided; lots and lots of interurban trolley cars, and a line of structures.  The brass etchings are really good, the rest, well.....   I'm not sure what "Programmed Construction" means, lost when you look at the instructions.   They were competing with Quality Craft, and those kits were far superior at the time.

I did the "Mayflower" open-end observation as a private car as a contest model back in 1979, took an NMRA award with it as I did full interior detail down to silverware on the table.  Really just a throwdown to the HO guys, I'll admit.

Since then I've been building a circus train tribute to J. Augustus Jones, Cole Bros. circus owner, lived just down the street from me, tragically killed by a horse kick in his own train.  The train is locked in to the date 1917.    There are photos of him with the train in "The Circus moved by Rail" (Carstens).   They also have that epic advertising car of his in the book that looks exactly like the Western Railcraft RPO.

Circus passenger cars were notoriously obsolete, and in the photo is shows vestibule-end, wood sided, truss-rod cars.   The only thing even close in N scale are the Western Railcraft kits.   I'm doing a train so far of 2-3 stock cars, 7-8 flats, and 4-5 passenger cars, which agrees with the detailed car-by-car train list published in "Billboard" that year.  And Jones had his own private car on the end with his family in it.

I'd come to the conclusion in '79 the only thing worth saving was the sides and ends.   I'd hacked up Lima standard cars to get bolsters, underbody detail, end frames, and clerestory roof.   The middle of the frame had to be scratchbuilt to size from styrene and stripwood, and the roof insert shortened to fit the sides.  So the 'new' builds took the same approach, including adding MT 6-wheel passenger trucks with a redrilled bolster hole.  Truss rods were brass .020 kingpins and soldered .010 brass wire.  End steps are from scrapped-out Kato caboose frames that have gone on to be pickup cars and tenders floors.

According to "Billboard", the wood coaches were painted in "A pleasing C&O color scheme", which a little research discovered was orange with red trim in that era, and it could only be that colorful if done over white primer, so the brass sides are primed.   Custom decals were made for "Cole Bros. World Toured Circus".
While there are few photos and no color of the train, it's amazing to have such a detailed written description of the circus to work from:
https://books.google.com/books?id=XaoiAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA72&dq=Cole+Bros+circus+Jones&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi6--Hi47ThAhVNeawKHQ6qC88Q6AEIQjAF#v=onepage&q=Cole%20Bros%20circus%20Jones&f=false


Partially finished second coach showing construction:


link: http://www.randgust.com/Western%20Railcraft%20603%20rebuild%201.jpg

Finished first coach:


Link:  http://www.randgust.com/Western%20Railcraft%20603%20finished%20car%201.jpg

So if you do see another one of these old dust-covered beauties, I could probably use one more car, or I may chop up an Overland car set like Mark Peterson did, the hard way.   Too bad Shapeways isn't still alive as that rendering would make a nice print.

The amazing life story of Jones has been a passion of mine, after some Historical Society presentations the local paper wrote a story on him from the material I collected.   The credit he doesn't get, that I suspect, but can't prove, was the original designer of the steel "Warren" circus flatcar, as it's in the town, he was having trouble with wood cars, and his bank financed all the cars for circuses.
https://www.timesobserver.com/news/community/2019/05/kings-demise/

If you go to the Circus World Museum in Baraboo, WI, the Warren flatcars still have the trust plates on them for the Warren Savings Bank, Warren, PA, which is directly across from my office; that was his bank.

« Last Edit: February 07, 2025, 04:26:05 PM by randgust »

thomasjmdavis

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Re: Western Railcraft passenger car rebuilds
« Reply #1 on: February 07, 2025, 04:00:33 PM »
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Your finished model looks great. I envy your skill and patience to work on Western Railcraft kits.  I have several of those old kits for North Shore trolleys, and some 19th century short passenger cars, that I've never found the round tuit for. 

Those coaches are quite similar in appearance to AT&SF truss rod cars of the early 1900s (just prior to the adoption of steel underframes on AT&SF), produced in several series and numbered 647-760.  The spacing of windows is a little different compared to photos, but almost identical to a sketch shown in the Coach, Smoker and Chair car book (p. 64).  I would speculate that diagram sketch might have been the inspiration for the model.  MDC did a kit in HO, that I always hoped they would repeat in N, but no such luck.



« Last Edit: February 07, 2025, 08:57:38 PM by thomasjmdavis »
Tom D.

I gave up rivet counting when I couldn't see an N scale rivet anymore.

Mark5

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Re: Western Railcraft passenger car rebuilds
« Reply #2 on: February 07, 2025, 08:47:01 PM »
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I remember those kits  :D

Your Cole Bros coach build turned out very nice! 8)

Mark


OldEastRR

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Re: Western Railcraft passenger car rebuilds
« Reply #3 on: February 07, 2025, 11:06:45 PM »
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Can't you just 3D print up the sides and underframes? Or is the joy in finding adapting and constructing cars from the old kits?

spookshow

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Re: Western Railcraft passenger car rebuilds
« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2025, 05:35:02 AM »
+1
My attempt to assemble one of those kits turned into an epic failure. However, I did learn a valuable lesson - white glue and balsa wood do not play well together.

-Mark

randgust

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Re: Western Railcraft passenger car rebuilds
« Reply #5 on: February 08, 2025, 02:32:53 PM »
+2
Can't you just 3D print up the sides and underframes? Or is the joy in finding adapting and constructing cars from the old kits?

I learned enough CAD to do one Shapeways print project, came out well, and I started on Fusion360 intending to get more sophisticated.  Then Shapeways closed.  My middle son is an excellent 3D printer, but watching his system work convinced me I could build almost anything quicker than draw it and print it.  I'm old school.   I have no interest in pursuing 3D printing at this point after watching what he has to do and how fussy the procedure is.  Give me a pile of brass, styrene and stripwood and get out of the way.

There's no particular joy in chasing these down, but I am patient.  If somebody else printed one I'd buy one in a heartbeat, loved getting stuff of Shapeways and did a co-op design on the Keystone Details decapod project with John.

randgust

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Re: Western Railcraft passenger car rebuilds
« Reply #6 on: February 14, 2025, 03:26:11 PM »
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So in this process - which is now complete for the second coach, I end up with a lot of 'stuff' left over.....

3 cars worth of unused Western Railcraft wood clerestory material, frames, bigger stripwood, etc.
3 (I think) original Lima six-axle truck pairs with the Rapido couplers
1 set of Lima steel combine sides and ends
2 sets of Lima steel coach sides and ends
More misc. stuff.
   (These were zona-sawed off the underbody frame; I used the end frame and bolsters and underbody detail)

I did my first conversion back in about 1978 to the Lima frame and roof, and wow, I still have the stuff left over from that I think, so keeping more of it is kinda pointless.  I've done four cars now like this.

If this is of use to any use to anyone else, free for postage, pictures if you want.