Foreign road hoppers?

[Erik PRR]

I'm planning to model a PRR coal branch with a couple of small mines in the early 50's. Might any foreign road hoppers appear for loading, or should I use PRR hoppers without exception?

[pjm20]

Many mines served by the PRR were owned by companies with their own fleets. Berwind and Westmoreland are companies that come to mind, but there was a bunch more.

[Erik PRR]

Thank you! But could cars from other railroads, say B&O, appear at a mine served by PRR?

[Bob Bufkin]

Looking at my many PRR references I've come across many foreign road hoppers in photos.  Lots of Reading, B&O, C&O, Erie, NYC, WM, etc. 

[pjm20]

Looking at my many PRR references I've come across many foreign road hoppers in photos.  Lots of Reading, B&O, C&O, Erie, NYC, WM, etc.

True, but on the main line (the Elmira branch, as usual, is an exception). On a branch it most likely would just be PRR cars, but if your branch has an interchange with another railroad, say like on the Shamokin Branch or other anthracite branches, it would be likely to have some foreign hoppers make the trips over, but if your modeling a branch like in western PA where it is PRR from the mine to the main only, I would stick with PRR only. Maybe a few foreign hoppers, but a vast majority would be PRR.

[Erik PRR]

Thank you pjm20 and Bob for your replies. I'll go for all PRR hoppers at the tipples, but if I run a through train there might be room for some other reporting marks.

/Erik

[cv_acr]

It wouldn't be too crazy for one to show up though.

If say, an empty B&O hopper ended up nearby for whatever reason, and the coal mine has loads going even in the general direction of B&O territory, it would be totally accepted practice to send it to get loaded and actually earn some revenue on the way back home instead of just being backhauled empty.

[Bob Bufkin]

On the now NS Lurgan line back in PRR days they ran a train from the B&O, I beleve at Combo, east to the steel milles in PA.  Ran on PRR to Shippensburg, PA where it connected to the Reading.  Train ran with PRR engines and crews and PRR cabin cars and was usually 100% B&O hoppers.  First time I ever got to enter an engine cab (F7 no less) was on one of these trains.

[Blazeman]

Depending on where your coal mine is shipping...

In some instances, if the destination is on another RR, that delivering RR would/could contribute cars to a pool that would be placed at various mines originating traffic they deliver. Idea not to generate revenue in on-line cars, but to balance off the per-diem.

So, if your mine is bituminous, W PA coal, destinations could be Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Bethlehem, Sparrows Point mills for example. Hence, you could work in B&O, NYC, WM, NW, RDG and LV hoppers.

[Pathtimber]

I wondered this same question awhile back, and I noticed that in my era (1970s) if there was a large cut of coal hoppers most of them would be from the railroad that originated the loads but other roads would be stuffed in here and there. I assumed it was because of loading rules about shipping a car back empty- if it could be loaded it should be before that railroads own cars. If they do it with boxcars wouldn't they do that with hoppers too?

[nkalanaga]

Pathtimber:  Yes, they would.  Per diem rules are (were?) the same for any freight car not assigned to a pool, specially equipped, or otherwise in restricted service.  Always send the foreign road cars back first, loaded in the general direction of home if possible, empty "via service route", in other words by the same route it took to you, if no load is available. 

Private owner cars, like most tank cars, are also governed by their own rules.  I don't know just what they are, probably "call the owner/lessor and ask what to do with it", unless the car or waybill has instructions.

That's why Trailer Train did so well, and Railbox could have, if the market for boxcars hadn't collapsed.  They didn't have to be sent home, so could be loaded for any destination available.

[Blazeman]

Gons on the other hand were free-runners and could be placed for any load going any direction. Problem was so many of them had debris from previous lading that there were high rates of rejection by shippers.