Help with BLI E7 (Partial Solution update)

[atsf_arizona]

One of the best ways to fix the intermittent electrical contact problems is to replace the traction-tired axle with a regular wheelset.  These can be purchased from BLI (I hope you still can, since I haven't done mine yet).  That traction-tired axle essentially reduces the rear truck to pick up by probably just two wheels, since the traction tires are insulation and the middle axle probably doesn't have good contact due to the thickness of the traction tires on the rear axle.  I also found that regauging my wheelsets helped a lot (for some reason), which is why I haven't gotten around to replacing the wheelset with traction tires. 

DFF

If it helps, here's my photo essay on replacing the rear wheelsets (I got replacement wheelsets by calling BLI Parts Dept):

http://www.pbase.com/atsf_arizona/bli_n_pa1_wheelset_replace



Yes, it helped.  Not perfect, but it helped.  I have to go and check out CV248 as you stated above and see if that helps me.

[davefoxx]

I've been thinking about that traction-tired wheel set again on my E7.  Unfortunately, it's never during regular business hours when I could call BLI to see if I can buy a replacement wheelset that has no traction tires.

Anyhow, my thought is to move the traction-tired axle to the middle axle and remove the traction tires.  At a minimum, I would now have four good wheels on the rails at each corner of the truck, improving electrical contact.  The middle axle, depending on the groove in the wheel tread would just be along for the ride.

Thoughts before I ruin a good locomotive? 

DFF

[peteski]

I've been thinking about that traction-tired wheel set again on my E7.  Unfortunately, it's never doing regular business hours when I could call BLI to see if I can buy a replacement wheelset that has no traction tires.

Anyhow, my thought is to move the traction-tired axle to the middle axle and remove the traction tires.  At a minimum, I would now have four good wheels on the rails at each corner of the truck, improving electrical contact.  The middle axle, depending on the groove in the wheel tread would just be along for the ride.

Thoughts before I ruin a good locomotive? 

DFF

I think it is worth a try. Besides, it is a fully reversible procedure (you are not ruining anything).

[mmagliaro]

Well, if it helps...

I have a Kato E8 that did not  have any traction tires.  It had great pickup, but I was unsatisfied with its pulling power and I wanted to actually add a traction tire.  I cut grooves and put tires on, and I did this on the middle wheelset of the rear truck.  Testing it with the wheelset in all 3 positions, putting it in the middle gave me the pull I wanted without ruining the pickup.  Putting it on either end cause a little intermittent pickup now and then.

I also found I had to cut my grooves a hair deeper after my initial test, in order to avoid pickup problems.  (This made the tire stick out less, letting the metal wheels contact the rails better).

So I think you are on to something trying it in the middle.    I'd try it in the middle with the tire first.  It might work.  The whole key is to have that tire graze the rails without lifting the metal "live" wheels up.   
If it doesn't help, then take the tires off and see how it goes.

[davefoxx]

Thanks for your responses.  I'll give it a try this weekend and report back.

DFF

[davefoxx]

Well, if it helps...

I have a Kato E8 that did not  have any traction tires.  It had great pickup, but I was unsatisfied with its pulling power and I wanted to actually add a traction tire.  I cut grooves and put tires on, and I did this on the middle wheelset of the rear truck.  Testing it with the wheelset in all 3 positions, putting it in the middle gave me the pull I wanted without ruining the pickup.  Putting it on either end cause a little intermittent pickup now and then.

I also found I had to cut my grooves a hair deeper after my initial test, in order to avoid pickup problems.  (This made the tire stick out less, letting the metal wheels contact the rails better).

So I think you are on to something trying it in the middle.    I'd try it in the middle with the tire first.  It might work.  The whole key is to have that tire graze the rails without lifting the metal "live" wheels up.   
If it doesn't help, then take the tires off and see how it goes.

My theory on the traction tires on the rearmost axle (as manufactured) is that the tires not only insulate the rear axle but they lift the middle axle off the rail just enough to prevent good electrical contact.  In other words, there are only two wheels on the rear truck providing good contact.  But for the powered frogs on the turnouts on my layout, this locomotive would not run well at all as produced.

By moving the traction-tired axle to the middle and removing the traction tires, I'm left with a truck that has good wheels at the four corners of the truck for reliable tracking.  That middle axle should just be a long for the ride (as far as tracking goes), unless that groove in the wheel is deep and causes problems at turnouts.  We'll see.  But, if all goes well, I should be at least doubling the electrical contacts on the rear truck by having at least four (and maybe six depending on the grooves in the traction-tired wheelset) good wheels on the rails.

DFF

[Cajonpassfan]

Let us know how that works out Dave, and what it does to its pulling capacity please.
Thanks,
Otto K.

[Mike C]

I picked up an A B set about a month and a half ago . The B unit had a TT wheelset that was missing the TT . If you go to their website and find the support button you can E-mail tech support . I asked them for replacement wheelsets without tires and they sent them to me free of charge .....Mike

[davefoxx]

I'm going to call it a moderate success.  It's running better, but, with the traction tires removed, it's only ten-wheel pickup.  The grooves in the traction tires are deep!  I will want to replace that axle, so I can get twelve-wheel pickup.  There's only one spot on my layout that it has intermittent trouble.  However, I don't blame the locomotive solely, since I've discovered a dead point rail in an Atlas Code 55 #7 turnout.

I'll email BLI for a wheelset.  Thanks for the heads-up on how to do that.

DFF

[davefoxx]

Haha!  I've got it running really well now, but you'll never guess what I did.

I had four Kato #932090 wheelsets that I got from @Chris333 leftover after upgrading the wheelsets on my Atlas SD50s.  So, I tried replacing all six wheels on the rear truck.  Please note that I reused the plastic axle from the E7, since the gear on the Kato axle is not centered as the BLI gear is.  The wheels are a perfect fit in the BLI axles!  Not only do these wheels perform better, but they look 100% better, too!  Sadly, I am two axles (four wheels) short to replace all of the wheels on the front truck, but I need some more Kato wheels to update my IM SD45-2 anyway.

DFF

[Cajonpassfan]

Hmm, but aren't the modern SD wheels larger than the E's? Like 40" vs. 36"? It may be woth the tradeoff, just asking if they *look* right...?
Otto K.

[peteski]

I had four Kato #932090 wheelsets that I got from @Chris333 leftover after upgrading the wheelsets on my Atlas SD50s. ...  Please note that I reused the plastic axle from the E7, since the gear on the Kato axle is not centered as the BLI gear is.  The wheels are a perfect fit in the BLI axles!  Not only do these wheels perform better, but they look 100% better, too!  .

DFF

Excellent solution!  Those Kato wheels look great and the metal/plating they use seems to stay clean longer. And those wheelsets are quite affordable (much cheaper than NWSL wheels).  As long as the Kaot axles are tight fit in the plastic tubes (no slippage), that is a perfect solution.

I think that even the older diesels, like E7, used 40" wheels.

[wcfn100]

I think that even the older diesels, like E7, used 40" wheels.

Nope, 36".  But I wouldn't assume the Broadway Limited engine has 36" wheels.

Jason

[davefoxx]

@Cajonpassfan, I think you're right that they should be 36" wheels, but they look better than the stock wheels to me, even if oversize:

Stock BLI wheels:


Kato wheels:


DFF

[Missaberoad]

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7167/6576422373_9d4d50fd04_b.jpg

This drawing confirms 36"

The Kato wheels look amazing compared to the originals... much improved...